Issue 14360 - Auto save allows automatic loss of data
Summary: Auto save allows automatic loss of data
Status: CLOSED WONT_FIX
Alias: None
Product: General
Classification: Code
Component: code (show other issues)
Version: OOo 1.0.3
Hardware: PC Linux, all
: P2 Trivial (vote)
Target Milestone: ---
Assignee: thorsten.martens
QA Contact: issues@framework
URL:
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks:
 
Reported: 2003-05-12 13:05 UTC by lukekendallhome
Modified: 2004-03-18 15:29 UTC (History)
1 user (show)

See Also:
Issue Type: DEFECT
Latest Confirmation in: ---
Developer Difficulty: ---


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Description lukekendallhome 2003-05-12 13:05:43 UTC
I've tried this in Calc, but I imagine the file saving mechanism is
part of the framework, not specific to that component.

1) Turn on auto save.
2) Turn off "Prompt before save" (for maximum usability)
3) Turn off "Make backup copy".
4) Make a terrible mistake that destroys data (e.g. delete everything).
5) Let auto save overwrite your last good copy with the bad data.
6) Exhaust the undo stack (or just feel muddled) and don't undo the change
and save before exiting.
7) File data is lost.

Suggested fix:
Auto save should *never* save to the working copy for the reason above.
So either build in knowledge of another automatically created filename based
on that of the file being edited (complex), *or* remove the unsafe option of
not creating a backup version of the filename.
Comment 1 thorsten.martens 2003-05-14 11:15:49 UTC
This is not a bug. When turning off the prompting message box, office
just acts the same way as it does when the save-button is pushed ! To
prevent such "problems", let the "prompt before saving" - option
enabled or disable auto-save !
Comment 2 lukekendallhome 2003-05-15 12:25:06 UTC
I don't think I made myself clear.  Having an option which functions
simply to trap unsuspecting users into risking complete loss of data
is not a feature, it's a design error.

I'll reopen the issue in the hope that you will reconsider.

If you close it again as "not a bug", I won't argue further.
Does it help to point out that Word used to behave this way; people
who lost data as a result never used the auto save feature again.

It's a classic design error.  Especially since the idea of a "prompt
before saving" means that "auto save" is no longer "auto".  In fact
it's less usable than just using the keyboard shortcut to save.  It's
a nagging irritation.  Most users would turn the prompt off after
being interrupted once too often.  And if they do, they then risk
destruction of data.

If you insist it's fine, you really should at the least auto-save to a
different file.

But it's your decision.  I'm sure the program includes a disclaimer
that no responsibility is taken for loss of data, so I guess you'll be
covered that way.

luke
Comment 3 thorsten.martens 2003-05-15 12:54:32 UTC
Sorry, but I don´t really know, what you want. On one side, you want
to use the autosave-function without prompting, on the other side
autosave shouldn´t do what it does ? Automatic saving ??? So what ? If
someone enables this function to save changes every ... minutes
automatically, he should know, what that means. Otherwise he should
consult the help. Sorry, but deleting a documents data and saving that
document (via autosave or "normal" save) is no kind of data loss.
Maybe a messagebox might be implemented, informing the user about some
danger if the prompt-function is disabled when using autosave, but
that would be an enhancement and not a bug.
Comment 4 lukekendallhome 2003-05-15 14:39:04 UTC
I'll leave this in the "Not a bug" state, though since you say
I still haven't been clear, I'll try one last time to explain.

If prompting for auto-save is turned off (I predict: 90% of
users who use auto save will turn off prompting), users can lose
data.

> Sorry, but deleting a documents data and saving that
> document (via autosave or "normal" save) is no kind of data loss.

It's not data loss when saved by direct user action.  It is data
loss when it's saved by auto-save.

The data loss may be caused by more subtle user actions than simply
deleting the data directly.  Some other complex operation may have
been a user mistake, and then an auto-save writes the file, and some
hours later (undo stack exhausted), the user realises their mistake
and thinks "Good thing I didn't save those changes", then discovers
auto-save *did* save them.

We agree that auto-save should always save the document data to a
file.  Absolutely.  That is, after all, its function!

All I'm saying is that either it should save it to a different
filename: e.g. %s.bak -- or else the "Don't prompt" option should be,
removed since it's too dangerous.  The former fix is the best, but
requires more work.  The latter change requires least work, but
seriously reduces usability.

Or do nothing, and wait for a user in months or years from now to get
very angry at OpenOffice.org for his or her loss of data.

It is, of course, your choice.

Signing off,

luke
Comment 5 jensja 2003-05-30 01:40:26 UTC
Same as issue 12259. 
Comment 6 thorsten.martens 2004-03-18 15:29:24 UTC
.